It strikes me that the comments that were removed were blatantly and transparently malignant, and wisely removed. As a psychiatrist, I long ago stopped worrying about what motivated such behaviour, or what more "reasonable" corrective actions would be appropriate. Nevertheless, the activities and presentations of those who submit such planned, detailed, and orchestrated disinformation as are the subject of today's post are particularly disturbing in that they are fully intended to change minds; and presumably, the minds they are intended to change are parents of children specifically who would benefit from the MMR and other age-appropriate vaccinations. These demand experts to address the disinformation directly and in spite of Mr. Kennedy's foolish recommendations as a lifelong anti-vaccine protagonist. For this I commend you.
Its important to talk about MMR from a global perspective. Measles was not going down in many parts of the world. It was after the Measles vaccination programs led by UNICEF, WHO and host governments that we saw a steady decline in measles outbreaks and lesser deaths in children from pneumonia who were under the age of 2. As Americans, we need to keep a close watch on global health. We do not live in an isolated world.
That is simply not scientific. In the 50s they used different criteria to define a case. There isn't any data using the old criteria and even if there were something else could have changed that wasn't controlled for like maybe fortification.
These align with my priors (I'm a co-author on the second one, so one would hope so!) but there are other researchers who come to differing conclusions, eg:
Disclosures: My employer, Pinney Associates, Inc., provides consulting to Juul Labs on nicotine vapor for tobacco harm reduction & Philip Morris Intl solely on US regulatory pathways for non-combustible, non-tobacco, nicotine products.
You are straw-manning the argument. Actually what is said is that "measles mortality largely dropped to very low levels prior to the measles vaccine." Ignoring this fact means that the benefits of measles vaccine are systematically over-biased.
It’s not just mortality though is it? Also one of the serious after effects of the measles virus is that death can occur between 7 & 10 years after the acute infection.
My favorite is when people come to a science page to spout anti-scientific nonsense and then lash out when they get laughed at.
It strikes me that the comments that were removed were blatantly and transparently malignant, and wisely removed. As a psychiatrist, I long ago stopped worrying about what motivated such behaviour, or what more "reasonable" corrective actions would be appropriate. Nevertheless, the activities and presentations of those who submit such planned, detailed, and orchestrated disinformation as are the subject of today's post are particularly disturbing in that they are fully intended to change minds; and presumably, the minds they are intended to change are parents of children specifically who would benefit from the MMR and other age-appropriate vaccinations. These demand experts to address the disinformation directly and in spite of Mr. Kennedy's foolish recommendations as a lifelong anti-vaccine protagonist. For this I commend you.
My comment on Beyond the Noise:
https://pauloffit.substack.com/p/understanding-rfk-jr/comment/93335102
Its important to talk about MMR from a global perspective. Measles was not going down in many parts of the world. It was after the Measles vaccination programs led by UNICEF, WHO and host governments that we saw a steady decline in measles outbreaks and lesser deaths in children from pneumonia who were under the age of 2. As Americans, we need to keep a close watch on global health. We do not live in an isolated world.
That is simply not scientific. In the 50s they used different criteria to define a case. There isn't any data using the old criteria and even if there were something else could have changed that wasn't controlled for like maybe fortification.
Thank you--really helpful perspectives.
In the tobacco and nicotine space, there are similar debates about trends and inflection points. A few papers that you may find of interest:
https://doi.org/10.1111/add.15385
https://doi.org/10.1186/s12954-024-01056-0
These align with my priors (I'm a co-author on the second one, so one would hope so!) but there are other researchers who come to differing conclusions, eg:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37940404/
I hope you find these of interest.
Disclosures: My employer, Pinney Associates, Inc., provides consulting to Juul Labs on nicotine vapor for tobacco harm reduction & Philip Morris Intl solely on US regulatory pathways for non-combustible, non-tobacco, nicotine products.
You are straw-manning the argument. Actually what is said is that "measles mortality largely dropped to very low levels prior to the measles vaccine." Ignoring this fact means that the benefits of measles vaccine are systematically over-biased.
It’s not just mortality though is it? Also one of the serious after effects of the measles virus is that death can occur between 7 & 10 years after the acute infection.
In the U.K. measles is a notifiable disease (from 1940) and we didn’t have the single vaccine until 1968. This link covers the number of cases reported and the number of deaths for England and Wales between 1940 and 2023 inclusive. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/measles-deaths-by-age-group-from-1980-to-2013-ons-data/measles-notifications-and-deaths-in-england-and-wales-1940-to-2013
contract measles and let us know how that goes.
I beg to differ. Roald Dahl’s daughter for example.
You’ve never heard of “Charlie and the Chocolate Factory”, “James and the Giant Peach”, “Matilda”, “The Giraffe, Pelly and me”?
Anti science movements have a long history actually, its latest proliferation is a sad thing
What do you mean poisoning ? Poison is in the dose, that includes water.
Mind control…you sound like your mind has been controlled by worm-for-brains.
Go shine up your aluminum hat.
You really are a dumbass if you believe heavy metals are sprayed. Just stop humiliating yourself.
You're stupid-ass logic will get yourself killed. I won't get in your way.
Don’t bother, bot account
Then I hope it incurs a different type of virus...
I mean troll/bot same thing these days.
Ah! Believe me I know it’s a troll. I still like taking my frustration out on one.